Irritable Bowel Syndrome and Digestive Health Support Forum banner

muscle spasms (IBS)

4K views 26 replies 9 participants last post by  eric 
#1 ·
Found a good site a few minutes ago which I breifly looked over, as of yet. It seems to provide ample information on muscle spasms; aka IBS. Theres actually treatment information based on self analysis that you can do. Hopefully this will help a lot of you. http://www.acu-cell.com/dis-mus.html Based on what I know of myself and the information in this site, I am pretty sure poor circulation is the cause of my Ibs. (explains why I feel better when taking blood thinners)
 
#2 ·
quote:ample information on muscle spasms; aka IBS
Muscle spasms have nothing to do with IBS.
quote:I am pretty sure poor circulation is the cause of my Ibs
I am not sure what this, but it is certainly not the cause of IBS.
quote:explains why I feel better when taking blood thinners)
Blood thinners have nothing to do with "poor circulation" either.
 
#5 ·
fiddler hes the guy who thinks he knows it all, thing is he knows nothing.spasms ARE associated with ibs, i have seen a top specialist and ibs is his particular field and he assures me that there is a connection with the 2.id rather listen to a professional than some know all, id like to
him.
 
#6 ·
hi again,Yes im not a specialist, but I was just sharing information that I found that could help "some people" IBS is different for everyone. Sorry for the confusionIm trying to cure myself and I am trying everything and doing as much investigation as I can. This site was talking about all kinds of spasms and I assumed it would be the same throughout the body. Might not be so for different people.
 
#7 ·
quote:Muscle spasms in the stomach area as well as the whole back area are associated with IBS *Positively!
I don't think the poster was referring to those kinds of spasms, but instead referring to "spasms of the intestines", although it appears that she was referring to ordinary "muscle spasms"But even these ordinary "muscle spasms" are not associated with IBS per se either, though it wouldn't surprise me if people complained of them and associated them with IBS. That may actually be a concurrent or underlying condition, such as fibromylagia.
quote:*quote "Blood thinners have nothing to do with "poor circulation" either"" whats that all about? !!!are you sure you knew what you were typing? just curious. because people with poor circulation are most definately perscribed blood thinners
Again, I don't think the "poor circulation" the poster believes she has has anything to do with IBS or blood thinners. Perhaps that could have been stated more clearly. If you had "poor circulation" in your intestine, you'd be dead.
 
#9 ·
Aqua, I checked out the site you listed. It doesn't mention IBS at all under diseases or conditions. It also doesn't mention IBS on the "muscle cramp" page.
BQ
 
#10 ·
The smooth muscle of the bowel are muscle.It is well known.
I use the hot and cold therapy just as a regular muscle against the IBS spasms.
Flux
 
#11 ·
quote:The smooth muscle of the bowel are muscle
Skeletal muscle gets "spasms", not smooth muscle.
 
#12 ·
Ah aH Flux,by the hand of a colo-rectal surgeon:Irritable bowel syndrome is felt to be due to -spasm- of the muscles of the intestines and to hypersensitivity to the pain of these -spasms-. A woman complaining of abdominal pain and difficult rectal emptying will be given antispasmodic medications. The idea behind antispasmodics is that reducing intestinal muscle activity will reduce muscle spasm and therefore reduce pain. Often these medications actually worsen constipation that is due to mechanical pelvic floor problems, since they slow the colon down and make the stools even harder. http://www.constipation.net/Chapters/10_ibs.html?[/URL]
More from the same place:C. Diagnosing Irritable Bowel Syndrome Medical research now focuses on the nerves, neurotransmitters and muscle of the gut as the cause of irritable bowel syndrome. For this reason I like the term painful intestinal neuromuscular disorders or PIND (my own term) to describe some cases of irritable bowel syndrome. This term has many points in its favor. It has less of the psychological connotations associated with �irritable�. It includes the symptom of pain mandatory to meet the definition of IBS. It limits the condition to the intestines, separating it from functional disorders of other abdominal organs; and finally, it places the emphasis on neuromuscular dysfunction as the cause of the symptoms.
The muscles can spasms
Back at the drawing board Flux
The truth hurt!
 
#14 ·
quote:,by the hand of a colo-rectal surgeon:
It's not unusual (or necessarily wrong) for a patient-geared website to use terms loosely in this fashion. I'm using the term in a strict physiological sense.
 
#15 ·
I only have problems to digest this quote:-Skeletal muscle gets "spasms", not smooth muscle.But that's ok Flux,nobody's perfect.
 
#16 ·
I think the "spasms" can be caracterize by pencil stools.The bowel seems to contract on himself.It's like an over reaction to stimuli.
 
#18 ·
I have invented a term:Intestinal arythmya.Is it not good?
 
#20 ·
#21 ·
#22 ·
BQ:Thanks, but I don't believe normal peristalsis feels like anything at all. I was referring to the abnormal sensations that I take prescription antispasmodics for. I don't understand why smooth muscle cannot spasm yet when I take something called an antispasmodic, I get relief. My GI doc prescribed them specifically to ease the spasms in my gut. She used the term spasm when referring to them. She did not call them abnormal contractions.I also found medical references that refer to spasms of both skeletal and smooth muscle. Here's one from Penn State College of Medicine: http://fred.hmc.psu.edu/ds/retrieve/fred/m...criptor/D013035 Eric:I'm not sure what you were pointing to in the URL reference. It was part of a different very long thread that also was discussing the existence of intestinal spasms. I didn't see a clear answer one way or the other.It's not a big deal but if we had a unified name for these sensations that both docs and patients understood, we would all be better off. Having said that, my doc and I appear to agree that I am taking antispasmodics to relieve spasms. The spasms are in my gut. The term is meaningful to both of us in the same way. If there is a more correct way to describe these sensations that my doc would consider more precise, then I would just as soon use that, but for now if I describe how I feel to her and she uses the term spasm we have what I consider to be a meeting of the minds.
 
#23 ·
Roger, they use the word spasm because its more laymans termonology, both for some physicians and patients."Thanks, but I don't believe normal peristalsis feels like anything at all."It doesn't unless you have IBS and sensitive nerves, or viceral hypersensitvity. The brain is involved in that aspect.There are abnormal sensations to normal gut contractions for one.The gut can also contract anywhere along it length in IBS, as oppose to normal contractions that move food out.Antispasmatics actually work on contractions.altered colon contractions can cause different stool shapes.Irritable Bowel Syndrome (IBS): Examining New Findings and TreatmentsAuthors: Marvin M. Schuster, MD; Michael D. Crowell, PhD; Nicholas J. Talley, MD, PhD"Physiological Differences in IBS Patient SubgroupsThe gastrocolic reflex, a partly neurogenic process, refers to an increase in colonic motility induced by feeding. Postprandial deviations from the normal motility patterns lead to altered bowel habits. For example, a spastic colon (eg, diarrhea-predominant IBS [D-IBS]) is characterized by an exaggerated motility response to food intake. This exaggerated postprandial response also occurs in response to intraluminal distention or to an injection of cholecystokinin (CCK -- a hormone released in the duodenum) in patients with IBS."Graph normal humanGraph IBS " Effects of Balloon Distention on Rectosigmoid MotilitySmooth muscles in the colon can impede and/or facilitate the movement of intraluminal contents. Haustral contractions impede stool movement; high-amplitude propagating contractions (HAPCs) are sweeping propulsive motor events that are typically clustered around bowel movements. The frequency of HAPCs is increased in D-IBS. In contrast, HAPCs are fewer and segmental impeding contractions are more frequent in constipation-predominant IBS (C-IBS). In summary, C-IBS is characterized by postprandial rectal relaxation, blunted gastrocolic response, and lower rectal discomfort threshold. On the other hand, D-IBS is characterized by a postprandial increase in rectal tone, an enhanced gastrocolic response, and hypersensitivity to rectal distention." http://www.medscape.com/viewprogram/725_pnt FYIGut 1999;45(Suppl 2):II17-II24 ( September )Principles of applied neurogastroenterology: physiology/motility-sensationJ E Kellowa, M Delvauxb, F Azpirozc, M Camillerid, E M M Quigleye, D G Thompsonf"Many of the symptoms characteristic of the functional gastrointestinal disorders (FGID) are consistent with dysfunction of the motor and/or sensory apparatus of the digestive tract. Those aspects of sensorimotor dysfunction most relevant to the FGID include alterations in: gut contractile activity; myoelectrical activity; tone and compliance; and transit, as well as an enhanced sensitivity to distension, in each region of the gastrointestinal tract.""Introduction Motility of the digestive tract encompasses the phenomena of myoelectrical activity, contractile activity, tone, compliance, and transit. In the functional gastrointestinal disorders (FGID), various types of dysmotility have been documented repeatedly, and most likely reflect dysfunction at one or more levels of the brain-gut axis. Patients with FGID also exhibit sensory afferent dysfunction, manifest as an altered sensitivity to stimuli such as distension of the gut, and selectively affecting the visceral territory. "Digestive tract sensorimotor physiology and pathophysiologyBASIC CONCEPTS AND DEFINITIONS RELEVANT TO THE FGIDMotilityContractile activity and tone http://gut.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/45/suppl_2/II17 Spasms are probably used for the layman. Its easier to explain then the above information and link.spasms, contractions (and there are different kinds), alter motility, distension etc. etc..This however I believe is an important topic in how the bowel works in general and in IBS and when distended, pressure sensitve cells release neurotransmitters to intiate contractions and communicate with the brain."CauseIBS is not caused by structural, biochemical, or infectious abnormalities. Rather, IBS is considered a dysregulation, or abnormality of brain-bowel function. There is increased pain sensitivity and abnormal motility (increased or irregular muscular movement of the gut). In IBS, diarrhea comes from an increased rate of passage of stool through the colon. Constipation is the result of a decreased speed of stool passing through the colon. Spasms, which are very strong contractions, also occur in IBS. Increased pain sensitivity results from the increased sensitivity of the nerves. Sometimes, the nerves are so sensitive that normal contractions, even with digesting a normal meal, bring on pain or discomfort." http://www.med.unc.edu/medicine/fgidc/question.htm I would say something important here in IBS is "the nerves are so sensitive that normal contractions, even with digesting a normal meal, bring on pain or discomfort.""So they use the word spasms as very strong contractions in the gut.I also emailed the experts on this at UNC."I was actually curious about all this myself, so I talked to an expert today about it.Technically and more accurately they are not spasms, but contractions.Even though a more archaic name for IBS use to be spastic colon. The word spasms might still be used more for laymans and for simplicities sake."
 
#24 ·
Eric:Your post above offers more conflicting evidence. One paper you cite says that spasm is probably used for laypeople. Another states that:
quote: Spasms, which are very strong contractions, also occur in IBS.
Fiinally. your discussion with the UNC expert indicates that contraction is the proper term. So, why do they call meds like bentyl and levsin antispasmodics instead of anticontractants? Okay, so if I understand this correctly, whether or not we have spasms is best left to the experts for debate. In the meantime, the term spasm to describe the sensations in our guts appears to be a perfectly acceptable term for the sake of our discussions here and discussions between ourselves and our docs.
 
#25 ·
Roger"In the meantime, the term spasm to describe the sensations in our guts appears to be a perfectly acceptable term for the sake of our discussions here and discussions between ourselves and our docs."YesThe workings off the digestive system are extremely complex.It would be called abnormal motility really."This is how complicated this really is on the gut and contractions.Gut 1999;45(Suppl 2):II17-II24 ( September )Principles of applied neurogastroenterology: physiology/motility-sensationJ E Kellowa, M Delvauxb, F Azpirozc, M Camillerid, E M M Quigleye, D G Thompsonf"Many of the symptoms characteristic of the functional gastrointestinal disorders (FGID) are consistent with dysfunction of the motor and/or sensory apparatus of the digestive tract. Those aspects of sensorimotor dysfunction most relevant to the FGID include alterations in: gut contractile activity; myoelectrical activity; tone and compliance; and transit, as well as an enhanced sensitivity to distension, in each region of the gastrointestinal tract.""Introduction Motility of the digestive tract encompasses the phenomena of myoelectrical activity, contractile activity, tone, compliance, and transit. In the functional gastrointestinal disorders (FGID), various types of dysmotility have been documented repeatedly, and most likely reflect dysfunction at one or more levels of the brain-gut axis. Patients with FGID also exhibit sensory afferent dysfunction, manifest as an altered sensitivity to stimuli such as distension of the gut, and selectively affecting the visceral territory. "Digestive tract sensorimotor physiology and pathophysiologyBASIC CONCEPTS AND DEFINITIONS RELEVANT TO THE FGIDMotilityContractile activity and tone http://gut.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/45/suppl_2/II17 and just so you know, if you took a colon and took it out of someone, but it was still connected and but not distended, you could bascially cut it with a knife and the person would not feel pain, but when you distend it, then it signals pain to the brain. It is only when its distened does it release neurotransmitters to signal pain to the brain.IN IBS their is also an impairment of the brain (ACC) in processing those signals.Gastrointestinal Motility and Smooth MuscleThis shows Peristalsis and Segmentation Contractions. http://www.vivo.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathp...i_motility.html
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top