Irritable Bowel Syndrome and Digestive Health Support Forum banner
1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
Great post! I found this really interesting. I thought the following was particularly interesting:"In his 40-year career, Levitt has seen only two patients (both men) who farted upward of 140 times a day, but these extraordinary cases were lactose-intolerant individuals and, once dairy products were cut out of their diets, they returned to the normal range of acceptability. "These two were the biggest farters of my career."In 40 years, only two like that. I also found it interesting when he said:"There are four possible reasons why some people fart more than others: They eat a lot of carbohydrates; they swallow air when they eat; the bacteria in their intestines are more efficient in turning carbohydrates into gas; or, conversely, the bacteria in their intestines don't consume carbohydrates efficiently, and therefore produce gas."Hmmm... no mention of bacterial overgrowth of the small intestine. He also doesn't state a food intolerance, which he previously just mentioned. Are food intolerances which cause gas then solely a product of your bacterial make up?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
611 Posts
Ha HA! I must say that this is my favorite part:"Actually, Brooks' character was named after Joseph Pujol, known as Le Petroman (which translates to the "Fartiste"), who in 1892 debuted at the Moulin Rouge in Paris with a show that featured Pujol paying a flute, smoking a cigarette, blowing out candles, even singing La Marseillaise from anus air. Pujol extinguished candles from 2 feet away and became famous for his imitations of thunder, cannons and 2 yards of calico fabric being ripped. Pujol opened his own theater (the Pompadour), in which he starred for two decades before dying in 1945."I doubt he died from "holding them in".
heheRegards, Lilymaid
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,398 Posts
quote:Hmmm... no mention of bacterial overgrowth of the small intestine.
Should there have been?
quote: He also doesn't state a food intolerance
Of course not, food intolerance does not usually mean lactose intolerance; the former has nothing to do with gas.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,847 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Flux, Actually if you believe food intolerance and food sensitivity are one in the same, I can give you a reason why gas may be involved. I just figured it out (or rather he did) when I read Dr. Gibbons book that I mentioned in the book review section under Jeff's post and in the Crohn's, UC posts. He relates the sensitivity-gas reaction to what happens when sugars such as found in fructose, lactose, and those alcohol sugars -in mannitol and sorbitol are not absorbed. Tell me whether you think this is an accurate statement:"Fructose and lactose cause problems when they are not digested and absorbed. they then pass into the lower digestive tract where the normal bacterial residents of the bowel ferment them, making large volumes of gas, alcohol, lactic and acetic acids. These compounds are highly irritating to the intestine and cause inflammation of the bowel." He also states that Sorbitol and Mannitol are undigestable sugars and often can behave the same way. He also states that faulty digestion of gluten can result in a similar way (fermentation - gas - alcohol and acetic acid irritation). He goes on to say later in the book:"Tolerance/intolerance for these sugars is genetically determined. In many individuals, lactose intolerance appears soon after birth. It is manifested in colic, fretfulness, diarrhea, gas production, respiratory infections (this reference I don't quite understand yet), and failure to thrive. This intolerance tends to disappear at about one year of age, become inapparent or partial for many years, only to reappear in adult life. Intolerence to these sugars may be ianpparent until the lining of the bowel becomes injured by drugs or infection. Many of the antibiotics injure the bowel mucosa, leaving sugar intolerance in their wake. Likewise, infection by protozoans such as amoebic dysentery organism or giardiasis may render the bowel sugar intolerent."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
quote:Should there have been?
I thought you're the one who has stated BO can cause excessive gas.
quote:Of course not, food intolerance does not usually mean lactose intolerance; the former has nothing to do with gas.
Well maybe it doesn't usually mean that, but that's how I meant it, which I think would be fairly obvious to anyone reading my post. My point is the article states he saw two people who passed gas 140+ times and it turned out they were lactose intolerant, then the article states there are 4 reasons some people have more gas than others and lactose intolerance is not one of them. Maybe they meant the 4 "normal" reasons this could happen. [This message has been edited by Ugh (edited 02-27-2001).]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,398 Posts
quote:making large volumes of gas, alcohol, lactic and acetic acids.
Generally, the products of fermentation is what you want; the problems only stem from certain bacteria: the one that make sulfur gases. That's whole point behind probiotics and fructo-oligo-saccarrides. Some have even tried treating UC with acetic/buytric/propionic acid enemas!
quote:I thought you're the one who has stated BO can cause excessive gas
Malabsorption can do that, but there many causes of that. BO isn't special in that regard.
quote:then the article states there are 4 reasons some people have more gas than others and lactose intolerance is not one of them.
First, articles in the popular press aren't 100% trustworthy in what they report; sometimes information gets mangled once it leaves the source. For example, only one person with LI was reported, but that was not the cause of the gas. That person clearly had a different colonic flora. Having LI was incidental.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,847 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Flux, there seems to be a normal amount of fermentation that normally occurs in us all, and that it what is supposed to happen is what you are saying right? But what happens when there is malabsorption of sugars - increased fermentation? If you add in bacterial over-growth/imbalance caused by say for instance antibiotic use or a microbial infection, then does something happen to the epithileal tissue of the mucosa as stated by Dr. Gibbons? Does it become irritated?Which bacteria make sulfer gases? You said some have tried treating UC with acid enemas. Was that a quack thing? What were the results?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
quote:Malabsorption can do that
that's why I said it should be in the list.
quote:First, articles in the popular press aren't 100% trustworthy
that was the whole point of my post, I was questioning the 4 reasons.
quote:For example, only one person with LI was reported, but that was not the cause of the gas. That person clearly had a different colonic flora. Having LI was incidental.
Are you reading a different article than I did? The one I read clearly stated 2 people, both LI, and that was the cause of their gas. "In his 40-year career, Levitt has seen only two patients (both men) who farted upward of 140 times a day, but these extraordinary cases were lactose-intolerant individuals and, once dairy products were cut out of their diets, they returned to the normal range of acceptability."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,398 Posts
quote:Flux, there seems to be a normal amount of fermentation that normally occurs in us all, and that it what is supposed to happen is what you are saying right?
Yes.
quote: But what happens when there is malabsorption of sugars - increased fermentation?
The colon (and the bacteria) probably adapts over time. This is apparently why lactose doesn't seem to be a problem for adults on Western diets who are lactose intolerant. The same probably happens if a meat-eater converts to being a vegetarian.
quote:If you add in bacterial over-growth/imbalance caused by say for instance antibiotic use or a microbial infection, then does something happen to the epithileal tissue of the mucosa as stated by Dr. Gibbons? Does it become irritated?
If the wrong bacteria get the upper hand, such as C. dif, then the colon can become seriously inflamed.
quote:Which bacteria make sulfer gases?
Desulfovibrio, Desulfobacter, Desulfobulbus, Desulfotomaculum and Desulfomonas.
quote:You said some have tried treating UC with acid enemas. Was that a quack thing? What were the results?
Definitely not quack stuff. The results are sometimes good sometimes not. Seewww3.infotrieve.com/medline/infotrieve/detail.asp?med9799+361954+"(colitis)+AND+(fatty)+AND+(acid)"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
More fart info, the bold stuff points out the variability (possibly from diet as flux said):"Insights into human colonic physiology obtained from the study of flatus composition. Suarez F, Furne J, Springfield J, Levitt MResearch Department, Minneapolis Veterans Affairs Medical Center, Minnesota, USA. To better understand the physiology of colonic gas production, each flatus passage of 16 subjects over a 4-h period was analyzed by gas chromatography for N2, O2, H2, CO2, CH4, and for odoriferous sulfur-containing gases. Appreciable intraindividual and enormous interindividual variability was observed, indicating that each gas passage reflected the interaction of highly variable liberation and/or removal mechanisms. The predominant flatus gas was CO2, H2, and N2 in seven, six, and three subjects, respectively. Gases produced intraluminally (H2, CO2, and CH4) comprised approximately 74% of flatus, and rapid CO2 and H2 productions were responsible for high passage rates. A positive correlation between flatus H2 and CO2 suggested that CO2, like H2,mainly was a bacterial product. Composition:Nitrogen (N2) Oxygene (O2) Carbon Dioxide(CO2) Hydrogen (H2) Methane (CH4) Other components in less portion, but they are responsible by smell (Methyl-Indol, Skatol, Hydrogen Sulfide, Methyl-Mercaptan)"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,398 Posts
quote:Are you reading a different article than I did? The one I read clearly stated 2 people, both LI, and that was the cause of their gas.
Yes..articles in the popular press aren't 100% trustworthy in what they report; sometimes information gets mangled once it leaves the source.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,847 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Flux, I guess what I should have asked was what foods produce more sulfer gas? Are lactic acid and alcohol end products as Gibbons suggests? Do you think C. Difficile is the only bad guy in the intestines that can take over?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,398 Posts
quote:Flux, I guess what I should have asked was what foods produce more sulfer gas?
any food with sulfur. This includes eggs, meats, and carrageenan
quote:Are lactic acid and alcohol end products as Gibbons suggests?
Yes, but I think the alcohol amounts are tiny.
quote:Do you think C. Difficile is the only bad guy in the intestines that can take over?
Probably not. Some people really believe the sulfur bacteria are involved in causing ulcerative colitis.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top