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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I made the mistake of having dried apricots tonight (I know, bad girl - the problem is I stocked up last week before I realized the effects and was quite tempted this evening...)Anyway, I am now a musical box and believe it or not, I only ate them two hours ago.I am not crazy to think they have caused an effect am I?LisaP.S. Flux - do not answer this post, I am not in the mood for you right now (well, for the rest of my life actually)
 

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Lisa, this question has a lot of variables.If you are c predomanite it would take longer.The bacteria as they break down foods cause the sulfur dioxide as a by product.It would also depend on what else you ate today.It also depends on some other things.Transit time differs in individuals and also differs in the person from day to day.normal is roughly Mouth & Oesophagus in minutesStomach in about 4 hoursDuodenum (small intestine) about 4 and 1/2 hoursthe large intestine about 12 hours the large intestine is where most of the bacteria is.These are somewhat actually faster times then may actually happen.
 

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Lisa, this question has a lot of variables.If you are c predomanite it would take longer.The bacteria as they break down foods cause the sulfur dioxide as a by product.It would also depend on what else you ate today.It also depends on some other things.Transit time differs in individuals and also differs in the person from day to day.normal is roughly Mouth & Oesophagus in minutesStomach in about 4 hoursDuodenum (small intestine) about 4 and 1/2 hoursthe large intestine about 12 hours the large intestine is where most of the bacteria is.These are somewhat actually faster times then may actually happen.
 

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However gas once produced moves faster through the GI tract than the stool so even if it takes 16-72 hours for the food to get through so the gas could start a few hours after eating.It is also hard to determine if the gas you have this second is from the food you ate a couple of hours ago (there are LOTS of sources of sulfur in the diet so if you ate any protien in the last 3 days at all you could have H2S in your GI tract) or from gas that is older but just now got moved along.I find that when I eat gassy foods the gas starts ~2-4 hours after eating and lasts a couple of hours (now that my fart frequency is low enough that such things are above background).I find that a pepto bismol tablet every morning seems to control the sulfur smell I have at this time.K.
 

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However gas once produced moves faster through the GI tract than the stool so even if it takes 16-72 hours for the food to get through so the gas could start a few hours after eating.It is also hard to determine if the gas you have this second is from the food you ate a couple of hours ago (there are LOTS of sources of sulfur in the diet so if you ate any protien in the last 3 days at all you could have H2S in your GI tract) or from gas that is older but just now got moved along.I find that when I eat gassy foods the gas starts ~2-4 hours after eating and lasts a couple of hours (now that my fart frequency is low enough that such things are above background).I find that a pepto bismol tablet every morning seems to control the sulfur smell I have at this time.K.
 

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LisaL:As I recall from a discussion last week, unless it was someone else, you consume sulfurous foods with regularity. You also described symptoms associated with a hypersensitivity to sulfur or sulfurous compounds.If that is correct KM has given you the root of the explanation for rapid onset of sufurous tunes following ingestion of sulfurous sheet-music, but well in advance of when the music would have had the opportunity to reach the conductor himself: ___________________________________"It is also hard to determine if the gas you have this second is from the food you ate a couple of hours ago (there are LOTS of sources of sulfur in the diet so if you ate any protien in the last 3 days at all you could have H2S in your GI tract) or from gas that is older but just now got moved along." _____________________________________If you are reactive, which you appear to be, to sulfurous compounds and eat them with some regularity, you have some source undergoing digestion and thus residing in the GI tract already, and if the dose is relatively low, the resultant local reaction in the small bowel may not be, at a given moment in time, sufficient enough to precipitate the release of enough motility-enhancing mediators to speed-up the already faster-than-chyme transit time (sub-clinical).However, the consumption of another dose atop the loading dose, even though the bulk of it may not have passed through the stomach yet at the time the gas production is noted, does not eliminate the sulfuorus food as a suspect. Unless you are swallowing it whole, you are chewing it up, breaking it up into smaller pieces, mixing it in the mouth with saliva and some enzymes, then swallowing it.As you do it is exposed to the buccal mucosa (oral cavity) the mucosa of the pharynx and the mucosa of the esophagus and even the lower respiratory tract by inhalation for some time. Sulfur compounds are readily off-gassed during this time. The molecule can be absorbed by this route, and even inhaled as you breathe during mastication.Asthmatics reactive to sulfur substances can precipitate an episode of bronchospasm this way.So any absorption through the mucosa of the upper GI tract results in the sulfur entering the plasma where cellular reactions can occur, in the exact same way as if it were absorbed through the dusodenal or jejunal mucosa. If you release mediators from circulating immune cells it does not matter if it starts in the bowel microvascualture or the upper GI microvasculature. It all gets comingled and distributed throughout the body very quickly. Any site a particular mediator can affect (there are up to 100 different mediators individual effects to consider) will be reached in this fashion and result in stimulation o whatever structure the mediator stimulates or activates or affects in whatever way it affects it.In this case the myenteric plexus (enteric nervous system) is not an island unto itself. It is vascularized...and hence mediator may be deliverd to the nerves through the lamina propria from the lumen (already happening from the sulfurous food you ate yesterday) and now we are delivering more from the systemic side vi the capillaries. Too much of a good thing can be bad.Motor nerve activity increases, smooth muscle contractile threshold is decreased, motility is increased , gas that was lollygagging around in there waiting its turn for expulsion gets sped along RIGHT NOW. So it is already preformed gas, not gas from that which you just ate as there has not been time to process it. But it can still be the immediate culprit.I have experienced this many times, as have countless patients I have met. Not personally with sulfur per se, but from eating foods which contained other chemicals to which I was reactive....boom....where did all that air-unfreshener come from so quickly?I do not remember your other symptoms in your symptom set...if you are d or cyclic predominant then you have to contend with the fact that the chronically upregulated state of the smooth muscle and nerves, which results in an observable exaggeration of the postprandial response, can be the mechanism of this phenomenon independent of whether more "ANTIGEN" is ingested. But eating a few dried fruits does not constitiute much of a big-bolus of food which would be potentially overstimulating.But even if you are c-predominant you may be storing up air unfreshener for sometime during exposure to what could be termed a loading-dose of antigen, then the next exposure is enough to create havoc. There is a subpopulation of patients with chronic constipation predominant IBS who do also have comorbid food sensitivities, but they tend not to (obviously) create reactions whi8ch are regularly evacuatory. Often they experience pain and other discomforts atop a motility problem which is sourced to a different "polar opposite" response.Anyway, the mechanisms by which this can occur are pretty logical and based on your history if I recall it correctly, plausible.Just resolve to stay off all the sulfurous foods for awahile and see how much symptom reduction you get just from that. Awhile means give it at least 30 days of 100% avoidance.Eat well. Think well. Be well.MNL
 

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LisaL:As I recall from a discussion last week, unless it was someone else, you consume sulfurous foods with regularity. You also described symptoms associated with a hypersensitivity to sulfur or sulfurous compounds.If that is correct KM has given you the root of the explanation for rapid onset of sufurous tunes following ingestion of sulfurous sheet-music, but well in advance of when the music would have had the opportunity to reach the conductor himself: ___________________________________"It is also hard to determine if the gas you have this second is from the food you ate a couple of hours ago (there are LOTS of sources of sulfur in the diet so if you ate any protien in the last 3 days at all you could have H2S in your GI tract) or from gas that is older but just now got moved along." _____________________________________If you are reactive, which you appear to be, to sulfurous compounds and eat them with some regularity, you have some source undergoing digestion and thus residing in the GI tract already, and if the dose is relatively low, the resultant local reaction in the small bowel may not be, at a given moment in time, sufficient enough to precipitate the release of enough motility-enhancing mediators to speed-up the already faster-than-chyme transit time (sub-clinical).However, the consumption of another dose atop the loading dose, even though the bulk of it may not have passed through the stomach yet at the time the gas production is noted, does not eliminate the sulfuorus food as a suspect. Unless you are swallowing it whole, you are chewing it up, breaking it up into smaller pieces, mixing it in the mouth with saliva and some enzymes, then swallowing it.As you do it is exposed to the buccal mucosa (oral cavity) the mucosa of the pharynx and the mucosa of the esophagus and even the lower respiratory tract by inhalation for some time. Sulfur compounds are readily off-gassed during this time. The molecule can be absorbed by this route, and even inhaled as you breathe during mastication.Asthmatics reactive to sulfur substances can precipitate an episode of bronchospasm this way.So any absorption through the mucosa of the upper GI tract results in the sulfur entering the plasma where cellular reactions can occur, in the exact same way as if it were absorbed through the dusodenal or jejunal mucosa. If you release mediators from circulating immune cells it does not matter if it starts in the bowel microvascualture or the upper GI microvasculature. It all gets comingled and distributed throughout the body very quickly. Any site a particular mediator can affect (there are up to 100 different mediators individual effects to consider) will be reached in this fashion and result in stimulation o whatever structure the mediator stimulates or activates or affects in whatever way it affects it.In this case the myenteric plexus (enteric nervous system) is not an island unto itself. It is vascularized...and hence mediator may be deliverd to the nerves through the lamina propria from the lumen (already happening from the sulfurous food you ate yesterday) and now we are delivering more from the systemic side vi the capillaries. Too much of a good thing can be bad.Motor nerve activity increases, smooth muscle contractile threshold is decreased, motility is increased , gas that was lollygagging around in there waiting its turn for expulsion gets sped along RIGHT NOW. So it is already preformed gas, not gas from that which you just ate as there has not been time to process it. But it can still be the immediate culprit.I have experienced this many times, as have countless patients I have met. Not personally with sulfur per se, but from eating foods which contained other chemicals to which I was reactive....boom....where did all that air-unfreshener come from so quickly?I do not remember your other symptoms in your symptom set...if you are d or cyclic predominant then you have to contend with the fact that the chronically upregulated state of the smooth muscle and nerves, which results in an observable exaggeration of the postprandial response, can be the mechanism of this phenomenon independent of whether more "ANTIGEN" is ingested. But eating a few dried fruits does not constitiute much of a big-bolus of food which would be potentially overstimulating.But even if you are c-predominant you may be storing up air unfreshener for sometime during exposure to what could be termed a loading-dose of antigen, then the next exposure is enough to create havoc. There is a subpopulation of patients with chronic constipation predominant IBS who do also have comorbid food sensitivities, but they tend not to (obviously) create reactions whi8ch are regularly evacuatory. Often they experience pain and other discomforts atop a motility problem which is sourced to a different "polar opposite" response.Anyway, the mechanisms by which this can occur are pretty logical and based on your history if I recall it correctly, plausible.Just resolve to stay off all the sulfurous foods for awahile and see how much symptom reduction you get just from that. Awhile means give it at least 30 days of 100% avoidance.Eat well. Think well. Be well.MNL
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
K,Thanks for the pepto reminder - I told Bonnie I would buy some and haven't yet! Will have one every morning then when farty.abcdefg - what would that test do for me? Can a GP do it? (she is better than my GI)Mike - I love you and you are so funny, however although I consider myself to be fairly intelligent, you accidentally typed your post in Greek.Thanks to all,LisaP.S. I promise I won't eat them anymore, I kind of wanted to test it though to see if it was the culprite!
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
K,Thanks for the pepto reminder - I told Bonnie I would buy some and haven't yet! Will have one every morning then when farty.abcdefg - what would that test do for me? Can a GP do it? (she is better than my GI)Mike - I love you and you are so funny, however although I consider myself to be fairly intelligent, you accidentally typed your post in Greek.Thanks to all,LisaP.S. I promise I won't eat them anymore, I kind of wanted to test it though to see if it was the culprite!
 

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Don't start on the full dose right away like I did, LisaL. It does completely take away the sulphuric smell but it leaves a different smell behind- not of gas at all but avoidable. Start with 1 tab and then build up if needed
 

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Don't start on the full dose right away like I did, LisaL. It does completely take away the sulphuric smell but it leaves a different smell behind- not of gas at all but avoidable. Start with 1 tab and then build up if needed
 

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quote:Anyway, I am now a musical box and believe it or not, I only ate them two hours ago.
To have a large volume of gas from food would require eating a significant quantity of undigestible material, so it doesn�t strike me as being related to the apricots.Also, sulfur gases are always produced in tiny quantities and make only a small percentage (like around 1%) of the gas, so this also wouldn�t account for any large volume of gas.
quote:Mine can start at less than 3 hours and last days.
Most of the gas is produced in the first few hours. The rest almost certainly has some other cause.
quote:abcdefg - what would that test do for me?
Give you an idea of how much of the gas is hydrogen.
 

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quote:Anyway, I am now a musical box and believe it or not, I only ate them two hours ago.
To have a large volume of gas from food would require eating a significant quantity of undigestible material, so it doesn�t strike me as being related to the apricots.Also, sulfur gases are always produced in tiny quantities and make only a small percentage (like around 1%) of the gas, so this also wouldn�t account for any large volume of gas.
quote:Mine can start at less than 3 hours and last days.
Most of the gas is produced in the first few hours. The rest almost certainly has some other cause.
quote:abcdefg - what would that test do for me?
Give you an idea of how much of the gas is hydrogen.
 

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It will test if you have Small Intestinal Bacterial Overgrowth and then they will give you antibiotics for the rest of your life. It is not sufficient to kill those bacteria once with abx as they kind of get back into your small intestine from the colon or maybe they just have difficulty going into the colon due to a motility disorder..So they congregate in the small intestine.The only fix they have for the motility is a low dose of erythromycin for the rest of your life on top/. So you will be having that on top of the stonger doses of neomycin 2-3 times a year to kill the bacteria.
 
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