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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've had IBS symptoms off and on for about 5 yrs. I'm a 25 M. I was on a low dose of bentyl (30 mgs./ day). I have since gone off it.Relatively recently I've had an accelerated heart rate when my IBS is flaring up acutely. Sometimes its to the point where I can't move because any activity exacerbates my heart rate. I saw a GI and he said that the reart rate and IBS were unrelated. He's refered me to a cardiologist who is doing some diagnostic tests- all of which appear to be normal so far.Does anyone have any thoughts ?Confounded,B
 

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You asked for thoughts, so here's my two cents.I have hyperthyroidism and IBS. One of the symptoms of hyperthyroidism is rapid heart beat...not constantly 24/7 but for me it was a fair amount of time. Walking up stairs would make my heart pound. Gastric distress is also a symptom of thyroid problems. Thyroid problems are commonly overlooked by physicians. If your cardiologist can't find anything maybe it wouldn't hurt to have a thyroid blood test done by your GP?
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
thanks for your response. Actually, my GI just ordered some bloodwork done, and is checking out some thyroid factors in the test- haven't got the results yet. Actually, my mother of 57 was just diagnosed with hyperthroidism not too long ago. Wonder if there is any genetic connection ? Thanks for your reply.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I have high blood pressure and am on medication for it. But when I have a bad case of C or D, my heart pounds from it. After the episodes, it calms down again. The doc said it is quite a strain on the BP to be straining or going so much every 15 minutes or so.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
When I get an acute attack (which usually means a bout of severe nausea), I too get an extremely accelerated heart beat. I find it very frightening, and have not had any medical explination other than the possibility that it is a panic attack. I find this hard to believe, as often the increase in heartbeat is what wakes me from sleep. Hard to imagine panic while sleeping but who knows...
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
well, it's kind of like part of the coversation I was having with my cardiologist: it's difficult to determine what is causing what. Whether disturbances in your stomach/intestine are causing a release of chemicals that increase your heart rate, or whther psychological perceptions (which may or may not be a result of disturbances in your gut)are directly causing a release of chemicals which increase heart rate. He agreed that correlation does not mean causation- but couldn't really say much more than that!
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
interesting. i'm male 25 too, but no rapid heart. infact, my heart rate is quite steady and relaxed. it'll be interesting to read what you find. especially regarding the thyroid.brian
 

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BHAVERS,Yep it will be interesting to see what your tests bring back since there is no apparent "known" mechanism per se that links this response neurochemically to what happens in the gut in "IBS" or "reactive gut syndrome". Cholinergic stimulation, for example, which occurs in D-episodes, increases gut motility via muscle contraction BUT if applied to cardiac muscle reduces frequency and stroke volume. This is avoided by corresponding "balancing" adrenergic stimuli.The "tachykinergic pathways" related to nociception and response have been seen, for example, to result in the same muscle contractions reflexively in the gut muscle and uterus as one consequence, and the location of the TKenergic receptors in the brain have even been sort of mapped...but I have not read about any reflex link to electro-musculo cardiac system from them...but a cardiologist certainly would know if there was such a thing. Or maybe FLUX or other such well-read members have read something I missed along the way which might suggest a link.So, apparently, the "thyroid conection" and any other cardiac anomalies if ruled out might suggest a normal stress-anxiety reaction which produces adrenergic responses throughout the body ("opposite" of cholinergic) and would increase heart rate as a result. I have experienced this mildly during "D"attacks. However, for me, I ALWAYS experienced the excessive "cholinergic" systemic reactions WAY much more profoundly.Please do not forget to let us know what investigation yields!Best RegardsMNL____________________ www.leapallergy.com
 

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I've had a rapid heartbeat since I was a child - not rapid enough to cause me problems but slightly above normal. I've been checked for thyriod etc and nothing has been found.It never occurred to me that there might be a link. If anyone finds more evidence on this I'd be interested.
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Mike,So it sort of sounds to me like you think that the gut symtoms and heart symotoms are incompatible with one another because one is a cholenergic pathway and the other is not ?B
 

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Could be temporary, caused by too much unrelieved stress. Could be a mild panic/anxiety disorder. Could be an autonomic nervous system disorder. Or all these things -- or something else!
Good to get it checked out. Many IBSers seem to have similar problems, which could make sense since IBS is a mind-gut nerve-related illness.I often have a high pulse, sometimes ridiculously high when I'm at the doctor's office. It can be embarrassing, but I can't seem to stop it. (I've been given the gamut of heart tests but seem to have a mild auto. nervous system disorder.)
 

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HI BHALVERS:My answer would be "yes but only in the context of present-understanding which is totally incomplete". In the most general sense the neurochemical pathway (cholinergic) stimuli that produce the gut evacuation produces an opposite effect if applied to the heart. There are multiple pathways that regulate the tone and motility of the GIT, but the basic physiology is one of "cholinergic stimulation increases gut motility but when applied to the heart would reduce heartrate and stroke volume". And the various other mechanisms that can be invoked in IBS via neurochemical mediator release just have not been examined in this context...and what is known does not appear to support that these 2 symptoms would share the same mechanism. Again, that does not mean I am saying it does not happen, because it does if people experience it. Only that there are probably 2 separate mechanisms, and they are related (in simplest possible terms, such as a stress-response producing adrenergic stimulation of the heart may result from the feeling your gut is about to explode and the fear that goes with it...so they are related).On the other hand, the research immunologist I work with has pointed out vehemently and more than once the fundamental mechanism which is seen in the IBS symptom set of loss of integrity of circulating polymorphoneuclear cells. This allows direct release of intracellular contents into the plasma of the microvasuclature of the small intestine on exposure to a trigger substance, and these mediators released then enter the systemic circulation as a result and are distributed throughout the body.The chemicals that can be released from granulocytic cells include (but are not limited to) not only preformed mediators within granulocytic cells, but potentially synthesized mediators as the reactions occurs (chemokines, cytolkines, prostaglandins and leukotrienes). Even platelet-activiating-factor is clearly released in some patients, as platelet aggregation is seen in the response. Leukotrienes in particular are extremely "strong" at low concentrations compared to histamine. Each of these intracellular chemicals has an entire chemical action-reponse matrix that goes with it in the context of normal immunologic reactions. But whose effects are not well understood systemically when they are just dumped into the systemic circulation as is seen in these toxic-responses to food additives and foods in sensitive individuals. These are not "textbook" hypersensitivity reactions, and what hapens to the granulocytes and lymphocytic reactions elicited are not textbook either.There may very well emerge a mechanism of action-response directly related to the presence of one or more of these mediators within the systemic circulation in the near future as work progresses.A protocol defining a means of quantifying exactly which mediators are most frequently released, what the extracellular concentrations can become ,etc. must be established first, then the investigators will know which path to follow in assessing tissue and neurologic effects.Apparently this is tough to do as their relative concentrations are minute, especially in the in vitro environment created to simulate the in vivo concentrations of allergen. I sat in on a meeting about this last night...over my head.None of that is actually being looked at in other research at this time...mostly functions within the neurotransmission system are being scrutinized, seeking chemical interventional methods.This is one of those things where it is easy to fall victim to the "flat earth" thought process, and that would be a mistake.Gotta run...Have a Tachycardia-free eveningMNL_____________ www.leapallergy.com [This message has been edited by Mike NoLomotil (edited 11-21-2000).]
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
There is somewhat of a correlation in people with mitral valve prolapse. People with MVP commonly have skipped beats and accelerated heart rate. They can also have dysautonomia which can manefest itself with IBS symptoms. In fact with mine, I have no idea where the IBS ends and the dysautonomis begins.MVP is painlessly diagnosed with a echocardiogram and is not life threatening.Another possibility is that it is stress induced.It is good that you are going to have it checked out. Good luck and let us know how it goes.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
There is no documented relationship between IBS and heart rate. "Normal" resting heart rate has usually been accepted to be approximately 60-100 beats per minute, but this range was based on flawed data. New, more accurate information suggests the normal resting heart rate in humans is 50-95 beats/minute.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
i actually had an echocardiagram today- so I guess Mitral Valve Prolapse would be picked up on that. The symptoms of MVP sure sound alot like mine.MNL- I appreciate your response. Although I am unfamiliar with alot of the chemicals you cited, I could follow the rudiments of your discussion. Are you an academic doing research in this area, or do you have IBS and also a biochemistry undergrad major ?!
 

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Hi BHALVERS>I am not the academic doing research in this area, I work with people who do and help "manage" them. My closest associate is an immunologist who has studied in the area of food and chemical intolerance for almost 30 years. So I get to be around him and other academicians and clinicians in immunology who are well respected among their peers. I am an IBS victim of 38 years, in remission for 5 years as a result of the discoveries of the immunologist I work with (he has patented several technologies over the years, and I work with him and clinicians setting up, for example, the clinical applications). My background was originally a Registered Respiratory Therapist, and have also done hospital administration, research, technical development, rehab programs, and post-secondary education in healthcare(founded and managed several private colleges). I just get to hang out with smarter people than myself, so I can pick up some things from them, and like others around her I read alot too.MNL__________________ www.leapallergy.com
 

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Guy is right -- their is no connection between an accelerated heart rate and ibs. There are so many causes. When my heart races it's usually due to stress, I also have a thyroid problem.JeanG
 
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