[Persistance]

I just don't get -- or agree with -- the connection you're trying to make, on several grounds.First of all, that "nurturing" males get more IBS. That one seems far-fetched. When women get IBS it has to with their hormones, not their nurturing natures -- and the reasons males get IBS is still rather more a mystery.2/And several things specifically about JFK. What is your definition of "nurturing?" You mention one who would "befriend" rather than "fight or flight." One doesn't think of the Bay of Pigs Kennedy or the tough Civil Rights Kennedy this way. JFK was certainly one of the more compassionate among our presidents, but I doubt many could say "nurturing," with its feminine connotations, was the predominant side of his personality. Tough, resolved, brave and stoic -- with the fairness, kindness and decency all the Kennedys share. Unless you have special knowledge of him, I cannot see where he falls into that special category of "nurturing male" that would prove your theory. I wonder where you are getting this from?3/Healthy males without IBS also have "nurturing sides." Clinton adored Chelsea and was very playful with her. He has no IBS. Jimmy Carter. He has no IBS. I could go on and on.

 

[trbell]

Judy, Take a look at the thread on befriend vs. fight or flight, I think it was called and read the article. women tend to befriend and men to fight according to the research which is pretty good. This is related to hormonal differences. As I said at the start this is speculative and only relates to conflict situations. It's also not a value judgement as it's based on me and the observation that a lot of men in the helping professions (and women, too) have IBS. this is not a causal kind of thing and it's not simple. It might mean, for example, that out of 10 women with IBS, 8 might be nurturers and 2 might be fighters and out of 10 men with IBS 6 might be nurturs and 4 might be fighters while in the general population 70 percent of women are nurturers and 30 percent of men are nurturers. It certainly has nothing to do with JFK's manhood. i personally consider nurturing males more 'manly' than fighters. let's take this off the board and send me a bc message if I've still got you confused by bringing this up.tom

 

[Persistance]

Maybe tomorrow, Tom. I will look for the article. It's obvious you are using these terms in a different way than I am used to.Just wanted to say that in no way did I think you were making a value judgement or saying JFK wasn't manly, or assessing him in any way. But, for one thing, I don't see "president" as being in the helping professions like teacher or social worker. And frankly, I see him as more of a "fighter" than a "befriender." My problem was not with your assessment of the man, but with the theory.

 

[flux]

quote:the paper I have says, "Their ultimate diagnosis was spastic colitis, which today would be described as irritable bowel syndrome." That's close enough for me

The evidence presented though argues against it.

 

[trbell]

it's not a theory, just a hypothesis that might be tested. Sometimes statistical thinking seems hard to understand.tom

 

[~JR~]

It is possible to have both IBS and colitis at the same time. Given that one article describes hospitalizations for his intestinal problems, it is likely that he suffered with some form of actual colitis as opposed to IBS, but both could have been present as well. We may never know as diagnostic tools weren't as advanced as what we have now, and terminology was often used interchangeably. JR

 

[trbell]

flux,I'm confused. what evidence argues against what?tom

 

[stymied]

if you read the Atlantic article it's pretty clear--as clear as it could be 70+ years later--that JFK's initial condition was IBS-D, and that the steroid treatments he began receiving even before college led to his back problems and possibly even Addison's disease--but that at first, and persisting throughout his life, he had severe diarrhea, spasms, all the traditional markers for IBS-D.

 

[Paula J.]

Sounds like he was pretty doped up. Don't really understand why someone with that many debilitating illnesses would want to be Prez. FDR had problems to. He's been dead a long time. But his glory never ends.

 

[flux]

quote:I'm confused. what evidence argues against what?

The following describes something other than IBS:

quote:suffered from severe and potentially dangerous bouts of diarrhea

 

[trbell]

okay, i think i see what you're getting at but forty years ago they might have written potentially dangerous in hte chart that the other doctor read?tom