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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know, I am just full of questions this week but bare with me, I am trying to get this under control competely
I keep seeing alot post about sugar being bad for ibs suffers, and my doctors have me eating alot of sugar to stop weight lost. My question is why is sugar bad on ibs patient? Two doctors have told me to increase my sugar intake to stop weight loss. Now I am sugar addictive, but since I am doing better with the D, I want to cut back and cross fingers that I don't loss weight due to not being able to eat high fat meals anymore. Thanks in advance for all those who reply to this question
 

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Sugar, has the possiblity to ferment in the gut and cause gas and hence pain, but sugar really isn't a problem in IBS if you can tolerate it. Just not good for teeth.
The high fat meal thing you mentioned though, that is a different story, high fat is a trigger for IBS and normal people's guts.------------------Moderator of the Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Anxiety and Hypnotherapy forumI work with Mike and the IBS Audio Program. www.ibshealth.com www.ibsaudioprogram.com
 

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Sugar, has the possiblity to ferment in the gut and cause gas and hence pain, but sugar really isn't a problem in IBS if you can tolerate it. Just not good for teeth.
The high fat meal thing you mentioned though, that is a different story, high fat is a trigger for IBS and normal people's guts.------------------Moderator of the Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Anxiety and Hypnotherapy forumI work with Mike and the IBS Audio Program. www.ibshealth.com www.ibsaudioprogram.com
 

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Thanks Eric, I seem to notice no diffence when I eat sugar, but I better watch the milk in some of desserts I eat. Honesty if it wasn't for the sugar intake I would be so much smaller than what I am, so the doctors were just trying to stop that from happening.I eat low to medium fat meals, can't handle anything real fattening after having my gallbladder out. [This message has been edited by LadyM (edited 08-15-2001).]
 

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Thanks Eric, I seem to notice no diffence when I eat sugar, but I better watch the milk in some of desserts I eat. Honesty if it wasn't for the sugar intake I would be so much smaller than what I am, so the doctors were just trying to stop that from happening.I eat low to medium fat meals, can't handle anything real fattening after having my gallbladder out. [This message has been edited by LadyM (edited 08-15-2001).]
 

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Well there are a couple of things going on.Why do people think sugar is bad for X, Y, Z, Q, etc?For the most part sugar isn't bad for you, it is what you don't eat because you eat so much sugar that is the problem. Sugar gets a pretty bad reputation and alot of the avoid sugar at all costs is sort of the current fad. Sugar also kinda serves a the totem for all that is wrong with the modern overly processed diet that most of us eat so people kinda rally arouns the sugar is bad message even though it isn't really a serious bad guy.And it does also tend to provoke the puritan if it feels good it must be sinful theme in American life. And we really like sugar. All mammals like sugar. When you are scrounging around in the forest for food finding a high sugar thing like berries is a windfall of high-energy food. But we don't live in the forest anymore but we still have that sugar-seeking instinct so many of us eat way more of it that is really good for us.AND we are back in the carbs make you fat swing of the diet pendulum. Fat used to be the enemy now Sugar and carbs are. Eliminating one thing from your diet is the magic that people get sold on for weight loss when portion control is really the thing we hate to do but does us the most good. Why can it really be a trigger food?Sucrose -intolerance is rare, but can happen. The vast majority of people readily break down Sucrose (table sugar) into glucose and fructose and those are the ones that are absorbed. If you can't break sucrose down than it passes into the colon and the bacteria feast on it and cause symptoms. I read up on this and actually think my Mom may have had this as she had one of the fairly classic signs of it. Most people with sucrose intolerance learn early on the sugar makes them sick and they cannot stand the taste of anything sweet. Funny thing is Mom was a great baker--didn't eat or taste any of it because any amount of sugar made her sick to her stomach as soon as it was in her mouth.What about the fructose. Fructose malabsorption is more common and if you can't absorb fructose well than 1/2 of the table sugar you eat goes into the colon and causes problems with the bacteria but I think fructose seem to cause less severe reactions than when sucrose gets into the colon probably because the glucose in it is the prefered food over fructose. In some people sucrose is OK but fructose alone is not as the presence of glucose aids in the absorption for fructose and when they are balanced they may absorb fructose well enough, but in things like high-fructose corn syrup they may not.So for most people sugar really isn't the enemy/trigger food it is portrayed to be. None-the-less some people will feel better when they eliminate table or other sugars.------------------I have worked for the government and at universities doing scientific research primarily in the area of the environment and the impact of environmental factors on human health, I have never done any independant clinical testing for the pharmaceutical industry, nor have I ever worked for a drug company. I have no financial, academic, or any other stake in any commercial, natural, or any other product mentioned by me.My story and what worked for me in greatly easing my IBS: http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/Forum17/HTML/000015.html
 

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Well there are a couple of things going on.Why do people think sugar is bad for X, Y, Z, Q, etc?For the most part sugar isn't bad for you, it is what you don't eat because you eat so much sugar that is the problem. Sugar gets a pretty bad reputation and alot of the avoid sugar at all costs is sort of the current fad. Sugar also kinda serves a the totem for all that is wrong with the modern overly processed diet that most of us eat so people kinda rally arouns the sugar is bad message even though it isn't really a serious bad guy.And it does also tend to provoke the puritan if it feels good it must be sinful theme in American life. And we really like sugar. All mammals like sugar. When you are scrounging around in the forest for food finding a high sugar thing like berries is a windfall of high-energy food. But we don't live in the forest anymore but we still have that sugar-seeking instinct so many of us eat way more of it that is really good for us.AND we are back in the carbs make you fat swing of the diet pendulum. Fat used to be the enemy now Sugar and carbs are. Eliminating one thing from your diet is the magic that people get sold on for weight loss when portion control is really the thing we hate to do but does us the most good. Why can it really be a trigger food?Sucrose -intolerance is rare, but can happen. The vast majority of people readily break down Sucrose (table sugar) into glucose and fructose and those are the ones that are absorbed. If you can't break sucrose down than it passes into the colon and the bacteria feast on it and cause symptoms. I read up on this and actually think my Mom may have had this as she had one of the fairly classic signs of it. Most people with sucrose intolerance learn early on the sugar makes them sick and they cannot stand the taste of anything sweet. Funny thing is Mom was a great baker--didn't eat or taste any of it because any amount of sugar made her sick to her stomach as soon as it was in her mouth.What about the fructose. Fructose malabsorption is more common and if you can't absorb fructose well than 1/2 of the table sugar you eat goes into the colon and causes problems with the bacteria but I think fructose seem to cause less severe reactions than when sucrose gets into the colon probably because the glucose in it is the prefered food over fructose. In some people sucrose is OK but fructose alone is not as the presence of glucose aids in the absorption for fructose and when they are balanced they may absorb fructose well enough, but in things like high-fructose corn syrup they may not.So for most people sugar really isn't the enemy/trigger food it is portrayed to be. None-the-less some people will feel better when they eliminate table or other sugars.------------------I have worked for the government and at universities doing scientific research primarily in the area of the environment and the impact of environmental factors on human health, I have never done any independant clinical testing for the pharmaceutical industry, nor have I ever worked for a drug company. I have no financial, academic, or any other stake in any commercial, natural, or any other product mentioned by me.My story and what worked for me in greatly easing my IBS: http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/Forum17/HTML/000015.html
 

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HI M-LADY.These quotes from the thread illustrate the overall lack of ability of many in the medical profession and out of it to articulate answers to questions about diet as they relate to this Syndrome:1. I keep seeing alot post about sugar being bad for ibs suffers,2. sugar really isn't a problem in IBS if you can tolerate it. 3. So some fruits might bug people and exassperate there IBS.4. I seem to notice no diffence when I eat sugar, but I better watch the milk in some of desserts I eat. To be succinct, discussions of food and additives and their role in provoking the symptom-sets that are lumped together into the "Irritable Bowel SYNDROME" are often plagued with misleading generalities. As you probe further into learning about your condition you are going to be confronted with this obstacle constantly.Like the stuff you mention in quote (1), about people writing "sugar is bad for IBS". Sugar is bad in your gas tank, but ONLY if you actually start the engine. Sugar is not intrinsically bad for IBS unless it provokes a reaction which produces symptoms. Then it is bad.Hence the quoted statement (2), the classical equivocating dietary advice of "food [x] is not bad for 'IBS' unless you cannot tolerate it." Lead is not bad for your health unless you swallow it, or have it injected into your body at high velocity. So saying sugar is not bad for you unless it is bad for you is said over and over in many forms as many in the medical profession equivocate over the role of diet in IBS, as it is not their personal area of expertise.Statement #3 is the same, except the precursor reference to fructose malabsorption suggests that this is the mechansim by which "fruits" can aggravate "IBS", so if fruit provokes symptoms it is fructose. Another too-narrow and very very common "explanation". It is one possible mechanism whereby fruit may aggravate your symptoms. One among at least a dozen possible mechanisms, which may exist singly or in multiple within the same person.MLADY, your last statement really defines (2)unhappy experiences/characteristics of the vast majority of people who are victims of the symptoms we call "IBS"....we beleive we know what does NOT effect us, and we suspect what does, either because someone sets forth a postulate that "this type of food is bad for IBS" or "if you get symptom XYZ then it is food A", or becasue we get a reaction after eating something and assume it is the thing we just ate making our body rebel. This is often not the case. Not to mention that cow milk products of course are among the most popular whipping-boys, as if whole milk and butter and cheddar cheese and yogurt and brie are all "dairy" and "dairy is bad". It ignores that fact that, to the body after processing, each one is seen as an entirely different substance or set of substances because it is. Things have been added, removed, heated and altered to make the end product, which may have totally different "allergenic potential or mechanism" than the whole milk. heck the whole milk in New Jersey has a different profile than the whole milk in Iowa.In an integrated program of case management and treatment for persons presenting with symptoms of IBS, after differential diagnosis is performed to rule-out obvious organic diseases, a program which includes effective dietary therapy, psychosocial support and therapy, and interventional pharmacotherapy is assembled based upon the patients specific profile.The vast majority of the time the dietary assessment and managment component, which has the potential to have the greatest positive prophylactic benefit for patients with IBS symptom set, is the least effectively implemented due largely to the ineffectiveness of the tools employed. Drug therapy is usually the best-implemented since that is the best-understood (as that is where all the development and publication money goes) and easiest for the patient to follow. It shows generally quick results in suppressing symptoms after the fact with little involvement in actual lifestyle modification (which is the bane of the human mind anyway).Behavioral therapies tend to vary in how well they are implemented based upon the providers experience and understanding in this area. As there are specific specialists to refer people to for this element, in CBT or hypnotherapy, it is usually better implemented than dietary management.Dietary managment is the least well understod by the majority of practitioners, as is the case with almost all prophylactic medicine. The principals of food allergy managment are applied to dietary managment in IBS and thus the therapy (as implemented in this country) thus often fails to achieve maximum benefit. Food allergy is a comorbidity in IBS but not an etiologic basis for the underlying problem. So these methods based on food-allergy characteristics of identification and managment, will identify only the most obvious cause-effect relationships: the ones whereby the response to a food or additive is immediate and dramatic. Unfortunately this is not the nature of the body resposne to foods and additives in patients suffering this Syndrome.The methods employed usually can detect and observe the NET END EFFECT of hidden food and additive intolerances which are occurring on a chronic and ongoing basis: twitchy bowels....as evidenced by an exagerrated gastrocolonic reflex, exagerrated migratory motor complex, upregulated sensorial and pressure-stretch reseptor function, lowered contractile threshold of bowel smooth muscle, excessive mucous production, chronic and episodic pains, systemic symptoms like episodic dizziness, chills, clamminess, ad nauseaum .So from these observations come the generalizations. Fatty foods are bad, and dairy is bad, and big meals are bad so eat many small ones, etc. There are many general guidelines for how to eat which will reduce the probability of us experienceing the consequences of what is happening in the small intestine. But they do not address the underlying problem, only make the consequences more tolerable.To understand the subject of food sensitivity vs. food allergy and how it affects the body including the immune system of the gut, a good book to read is the following....having read it you will come away with a better understanding of the many different ways in which the symptoms we exprience can be made to occur by the different things we consume, either intentionally or accidentally:�FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENT�, Professor Jonathan Brostoff (M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kings� College, London) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...r=2-1/102-64875 08-3420903[/URL] You will learn from this book, and other reference materials that can be provided from the work of practitioners who specialize in this area of medicine, that there are a multitude of mechanisms of food or additive "sensitivity or intolerance" and why some are easy to assess, but the ones that hurt us most in IBS are very hard to find.You can be intolerant of something based upon a simple enzyme deficieny. You can be intolerant of something due to a disruption of the gut flora which makes it hard to digest an element of certain types of foods properly. You can be intolerant of something due to classic allergy to it. You can be intolerant of something due to a chemical within that food which is naturally-occurring as a protective mechanism of the plant, which makes you sick when you eat it. You can get a "false" food allergy triggered by a chemical in the food. And, as the majority of the food intolerant reactions are, you can (for reasons that remain unnclear still) suffer a dysfunction of the normal small-bowel immune system and circulating cellular immune system which causes the body to misidentify certain foods or additives as harmful and react accordingly, irritating or overstimulating other body structures in the process. You can even suffer a direct toxic effect upon the immune cells from certain chemicals in the diet which will destroy the cell walls of immune cells, and then cause the same thing to happen anyway...free-mediators loose in the plasma.So this is why sugar can be bad for you or it may not, in the context of precipitating the symptoms of IBS. Some people react to milk sugar or cane sugar but not fructose, and vice versa, and the reaction is not driven by an imbalance of the flora. It can be a loss of tolerance. On the other hand it could be exactly the opposite. OR it could be BOTH. You could be reactive to an apple itself AND to the fructose in it, or to the apple but not the fructose immunologically BUT have trouble breaking-down the fructose within the lumen of the gut, which produces its own symptoms.You are obviously interested in the subject. You CAN learn alot about it which is helpful. So I recommend Professor Brostoffs book above, as he is the acknowledged leader in this area, with a very good understanding of the subject and the ability to convey that knowledge to patients as well as other doctors.It will be the best $18 you spend on managing your symptoms.In the meantime....Eat well, think well, Be well.MNL________________ www.leapallergy.com [This message has been edited by Mike NoLomotil (edited 08-15-2001).]
 

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HI M-LADY.These quotes from the thread illustrate the overall lack of ability of many in the medical profession and out of it to articulate answers to questions about diet as they relate to this Syndrome:1. I keep seeing alot post about sugar being bad for ibs suffers,2. sugar really isn't a problem in IBS if you can tolerate it. 3. So some fruits might bug people and exassperate there IBS.4. I seem to notice no diffence when I eat sugar, but I better watch the milk in some of desserts I eat. To be succinct, discussions of food and additives and their role in provoking the symptom-sets that are lumped together into the "Irritable Bowel SYNDROME" are often plagued with misleading generalities. As you probe further into learning about your condition you are going to be confronted with this obstacle constantly.Like the stuff you mention in quote (1), about people writing "sugar is bad for IBS". Sugar is bad in your gas tank, but ONLY if you actually start the engine. Sugar is not intrinsically bad for IBS unless it provokes a reaction which produces symptoms. Then it is bad.Hence the quoted statement (2), the classical equivocating dietary advice of "food [x] is not bad for 'IBS' unless you cannot tolerate it." Lead is not bad for your health unless you swallow it, or have it injected into your body at high velocity. So saying sugar is not bad for you unless it is bad for you is said over and over in many forms as many in the medical profession equivocate over the role of diet in IBS, as it is not their personal area of expertise.Statement #3 is the same, except the precursor reference to fructose malabsorption suggests that this is the mechansim by which "fruits" can aggravate "IBS", so if fruit provokes symptoms it is fructose. Another too-narrow and very very common "explanation". It is one possible mechanism whereby fruit may aggravate your symptoms. One among at least a dozen possible mechanisms, which may exist singly or in multiple within the same person.MLADY, your last statement really defines (2)unhappy experiences/characteristics of the vast majority of people who are victims of the symptoms we call "IBS"....we beleive we know what does NOT effect us, and we suspect what does, either because someone sets forth a postulate that "this type of food is bad for IBS" or "if you get symptom XYZ then it is food A", or becasue we get a reaction after eating something and assume it is the thing we just ate making our body rebel. This is often not the case. Not to mention that cow milk products of course are among the most popular whipping-boys, as if whole milk and butter and cheddar cheese and yogurt and brie are all "dairy" and "dairy is bad". It ignores that fact that, to the body after processing, each one is seen as an entirely different substance or set of substances because it is. Things have been added, removed, heated and altered to make the end product, which may have totally different "allergenic potential or mechanism" than the whole milk. heck the whole milk in New Jersey has a different profile than the whole milk in Iowa.In an integrated program of case management and treatment for persons presenting with symptoms of IBS, after differential diagnosis is performed to rule-out obvious organic diseases, a program which includes effective dietary therapy, psychosocial support and therapy, and interventional pharmacotherapy is assembled based upon the patients specific profile.The vast majority of the time the dietary assessment and managment component, which has the potential to have the greatest positive prophylactic benefit for patients with IBS symptom set, is the least effectively implemented due largely to the ineffectiveness of the tools employed. Drug therapy is usually the best-implemented since that is the best-understood (as that is where all the development and publication money goes) and easiest for the patient to follow. It shows generally quick results in suppressing symptoms after the fact with little involvement in actual lifestyle modification (which is the bane of the human mind anyway).Behavioral therapies tend to vary in how well they are implemented based upon the providers experience and understanding in this area. As there are specific specialists to refer people to for this element, in CBT or hypnotherapy, it is usually better implemented than dietary management.Dietary managment is the least well understod by the majority of practitioners, as is the case with almost all prophylactic medicine. The principals of food allergy managment are applied to dietary managment in IBS and thus the therapy (as implemented in this country) thus often fails to achieve maximum benefit. Food allergy is a comorbidity in IBS but not an etiologic basis for the underlying problem. So these methods based on food-allergy characteristics of identification and managment, will identify only the most obvious cause-effect relationships: the ones whereby the response to a food or additive is immediate and dramatic. Unfortunately this is not the nature of the body resposne to foods and additives in patients suffering this Syndrome.The methods employed usually can detect and observe the NET END EFFECT of hidden food and additive intolerances which are occurring on a chronic and ongoing basis: twitchy bowels....as evidenced by an exagerrated gastrocolonic reflex, exagerrated migratory motor complex, upregulated sensorial and pressure-stretch reseptor function, lowered contractile threshold of bowel smooth muscle, excessive mucous production, chronic and episodic pains, systemic symptoms like episodic dizziness, chills, clamminess, ad nauseaum .So from these observations come the generalizations. Fatty foods are bad, and dairy is bad, and big meals are bad so eat many small ones, etc. There are many general guidelines for how to eat which will reduce the probability of us experienceing the consequences of what is happening in the small intestine. But they do not address the underlying problem, only make the consequences more tolerable.To understand the subject of food sensitivity vs. food allergy and how it affects the body including the immune system of the gut, a good book to read is the following....having read it you will come away with a better understanding of the many different ways in which the symptoms we exprience can be made to occur by the different things we consume, either intentionally or accidentally:�FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENT�, Professor Jonathan Brostoff (M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kings� College, London) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...r=2-1/102-64875 08-3420903[/URL] You will learn from this book, and other reference materials that can be provided from the work of practitioners who specialize in this area of medicine, that there are a multitude of mechanisms of food or additive "sensitivity or intolerance" and why some are easy to assess, but the ones that hurt us most in IBS are very hard to find.You can be intolerant of something based upon a simple enzyme deficieny. You can be intolerant of something due to a disruption of the gut flora which makes it hard to digest an element of certain types of foods properly. You can be intolerant of something due to classic allergy to it. You can be intolerant of something due to a chemical within that food which is naturally-occurring as a protective mechanism of the plant, which makes you sick when you eat it. You can get a "false" food allergy triggered by a chemical in the food. And, as the majority of the food intolerant reactions are, you can (for reasons that remain unnclear still) suffer a dysfunction of the normal small-bowel immune system and circulating cellular immune system which causes the body to misidentify certain foods or additives as harmful and react accordingly, irritating or overstimulating other body structures in the process. You can even suffer a direct toxic effect upon the immune cells from certain chemicals in the diet which will destroy the cell walls of immune cells, and then cause the same thing to happen anyway...free-mediators loose in the plasma.So this is why sugar can be bad for you or it may not, in the context of precipitating the symptoms of IBS. Some people react to milk sugar or cane sugar but not fructose, and vice versa, and the reaction is not driven by an imbalance of the flora. It can be a loss of tolerance. On the other hand it could be exactly the opposite. OR it could be BOTH. You could be reactive to an apple itself AND to the fructose in it, or to the apple but not the fructose immunologically BUT have trouble breaking-down the fructose within the lumen of the gut, which produces its own symptoms.You are obviously interested in the subject. You CAN learn alot about it which is helpful. So I recommend Professor Brostoffs book above, as he is the acknowledged leader in this area, with a very good understanding of the subject and the ability to convey that knowledge to patients as well as other doctors.It will be the best $18 you spend on managing your symptoms.In the meantime....Eat well, think well, Be well.MNL________________ www.leapallergy.com [This message has been edited by Mike NoLomotil (edited 08-15-2001).]
 

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Sugar isn't a trigger food. Like Eric said it causes fermentation in the gut and thus gas. I know I use to live on sweets..... plain sugar has no nutritional value and once you fill yourself up on it you don't eat the foods that you should be eating. You can gt plenty of carbs in fruits etc.Try olive oil, it puts on weight.... I add it to everything I can......
It is a good fat that one can use. helps cut cholestrolyogurt made of 1/2 & 1/2 adds weight too. Made my own; but then found that dairy wasn't so good for me.
------------------You will never know that God is all you need....... until God is all you have. �� Prayer doesn't change God , it changes the one who prays..C type, with G
 

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Sugar isn't a trigger food. Like Eric said it causes fermentation in the gut and thus gas. I know I use to live on sweets..... plain sugar has no nutritional value and once you fill yourself up on it you don't eat the foods that you should be eating. You can gt plenty of carbs in fruits etc.Try olive oil, it puts on weight.... I add it to everything I can......
It is a good fat that one can use. helps cut cholestrolyogurt made of 1/2 & 1/2 adds weight too. Made my own; but then found that dairy wasn't so good for me.
------------------You will never know that God is all you need....... until God is all you have. �� Prayer doesn't change God , it changes the one who prays..C type, with G
 

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This is very interesting and informative, thanks everyone.However, I identified sugars, fruits, and onion as trigger foods, and the symptoms are in my *stomach* not my small intestine. Sugars cause me acid pain and heartburn. I rarely get lower ab symptoms from it, except for the "comeback" effect from onion.My doctors were puzzled because I presented 2 sets of symptoms - lactose intolerance caused the lower, sugars the upper.Do you have any thoughts on why sugars would cause acid pain? I haven't tried enzymes yet, maybe I'll give that a shot.
 

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This is very interesting and informative, thanks everyone.However, I identified sugars, fruits, and onion as trigger foods, and the symptoms are in my *stomach* not my small intestine. Sugars cause me acid pain and heartburn. I rarely get lower ab symptoms from it, except for the "comeback" effect from onion.My doctors were puzzled because I presented 2 sets of symptoms - lactose intolerance caused the lower, sugars the upper.Do you have any thoughts on why sugars would cause acid pain? I haven't tried enzymes yet, maybe I'll give that a shot.
 

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Hi,Sugar feeds bacteria, parasites and yeasts. Carbohydrates are broken down into sugar in the digestive process. Some foods are higher in carbs than others.When path labs culture (ie. grow) organisms they don't use celery (!)- they use foods high in sugar (ie. rice starch) or other bacteria to feed whatever organism they are trying to grow (some parasites cannot survive without other bacteria). It's likely that dairy products, which contain bacteria and are also high in sugar, feed parasites and pathogenic bacteria. More info. about half way down this page: http://bara.idx.com.au/dfragilis/ibs_a_misdiagnoses.htm Jackie
 

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Hi,Sugar feeds bacteria, parasites and yeasts. Carbohydrates are broken down into sugar in the digestive process. Some foods are higher in carbs than others.When path labs culture (ie. grow) organisms they don't use celery (!)- they use foods high in sugar (ie. rice starch) or other bacteria to feed whatever organism they are trying to grow (some parasites cannot survive without other bacteria). It's likely that dairy products, which contain bacteria and are also high in sugar, feed parasites and pathogenic bacteria. More info. about half way down this page: http://bara.idx.com.au/dfragilis/ibs_a_misdiagnoses.htm Jackie
 

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I don't get it. Isn't plain sugar just completely absorbed into the bloodstream with no residue. Is it that common for any to get to the colon? What about the effects of other sweeteners on gas (Karo light corn syrup, molasses or honey for instance)?
 

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I don't get it. Isn't plain sugar just completely absorbed into the bloodstream with no residue. Is it that common for any to get to the colon? What about the effects of other sweeteners on gas (Karo light corn syrup, molasses or honey for instance)?
 

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Comments to clarify some misconceptions in the discussion:First (2) corrections. To state sugar "is not a trigger food" is incorrect. It is correct to describe ONE of the mechanisms of sugar becoming a provocateur of intestinal discomfort (vis a vis digestive dysfunction and the flora discussions) exactly as everyone describes.Also, folks query correctly concerning the absorption of certain sugars into the blood stream and a tutorial on carbohydrate structure and function and digestion and monsaccharides and disaccharides and polysaccharides is guarnteed to suck up my morning and bore you to tears. But the question is good as it illustrative of the most common misconception-now-dogma about IBS symptoms sets (in particular d-predominant and cyclic symptom sets): that the colon is the shock organ. It's not. It is an "affected organ" by things that happen elsewhere. In some patients ultimately the proximal colon starts to get in on the act as the density of mast cells builds up in the ileocecal tissues over time, but its not the source of the original problem.So lets just correct the misconception that the colon has anything to do with if something is a so called "trigger food". That definitiona varies with who defines it, but I now what you are thinking and in IBS symptom sets the colon is mostly an innocent bystander whe gets to become collateral damage. The action takes place in the small intestine so indeed the colon is out of the picture.Sucrose (table sugar a disaccharide), fructose (fruit sugar a monosaccharide like glucose), lactose (milk sugar which hydrolyzes to galactose) ad nauseum and even polysaccharides (like starch) are NOT banned from absorption into the bloodstream from the small intestine 100% until "broken down fully" into their simplest "monasaccharode" form. In fact you can give somehow a glass of liquid full of potato starch you will find the starch in the plasma some hours later.This is because the gut wall does not "rigidly exclude" all foood molecules. The fact is the body normally learns to NOT mount a major "immune attack" on food by distinguishing foods from pathogens. If some tiny particles of everything you eat are not allowed into the bloodstream this process cannot take place. This happens in the small intestines microvasculature at first, while the foods are being broken down for use as nutrients. In IBS victims the bowel wall is sometimes over-permeable as well as a result of a malfunction of this process (sometimes called the "oral tolerance" mechanism), and this further aggravtes the problem sketchily described next.It is beleived, but still not entirely clear, that the immune system is able to distinguish the food particles from pathogens because they are both smaller and do not tend to adhere to the cell membranes of certain immune cells in the plasma. This tendency of pathogens to do that is sort of a giveaway to the immune system.T-supressor cells are a primary modulator in this mechanism, and are produced by the body to tone-down the response to the "food" molecule once it is recognized as safe, and these t-cells also have other roles such as influencing the type of antibody produced in response to different types of molecules which enter the bloodstream (foods and components vs pathogens).The immunoglobulin which plays the key role in bodys response to food is IgA. When a bad-guy gets into the blood (pathogen) IgG and/or IgM antibodies meet the invader which are specific to sites on the surface of the pathogen and form immune complexes. Once bound this triggers an all out attack by the immune system on the invader. The consequences are that in the process dozens of various chemical mediators are invoked, and released, into the area....and into the system as the immune complexes circulate about. So this causes local and systemic symptoms when your body is trying to isolate and destroy an invader.IgA is different. In general it can be described as when it "binds" with a safe target like a food or component-of-food molecule it does not normally elicit the same response. Instead the immune complexes floating about are then consumed and removed by phagocytes without consequence.Now, going into the various ways that are known, sort of known, observed but not understood, and downright baffling that this mechanism can be and is confirmed as being disrupted and thus cause food allergies and non-allergic food reactions (non-digestion related sensitivity or intolerance) would require way more time and space than available. Thats why I recommend this book to people who want to understand the subject correctly:�FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENT�, Professor Jonathan Brostoff (M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kings� College, London) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...r=2-1/102-64875 08-3420903[/URL] ...and a good introductory Immunology book loaded with pictures of the different basic mechanisms and lots of info about the various mediators involved and their effects on the body is THE IMMUNE SYSTEM by Peter Parham, or ANY of Brostoffs several immunology books.Anyway, to start delving into secretory IgA, leaky gut walls and what causes it in IBS, et al is not the point.The point is that not all that precipitates bowel trouble and/or other symptoms from sugars is purely flora or enzyme related, nor allergic either....there are a number of ways that the body oral tolerance mechanism malfunctions and produces inappopriate immune reactions in the small bowel and microvasculature of the small bowel and thus into the rest of the body via the circulation and the symptoms we experience originate in the small bowel as the shock organ not the colon. In fact, this malfunction is more way more common than the others, and may or may not be comorbid with "digestive dysfunction" as has been discussed already. Almost any substance except salt and water can be involved in a loss of oral tolerance-related event. This is one of the many difficulties facing people with symptom sets related to underlying food or chemical sensitivities, and not just IBS people but migraine victims, cluster headaches, some fatigue manifestations, certain types of aberrant eating behavors that result in weight problems, and even, it appears, autistics suffer from this phenomenon as part of their condition and it is an aggravant to that condition (not the cause but it makes it worse by lowering cognitive function further through the effects of specific mediators upon the CNS). That's under ongoing study right now.Eat well, think well, be well.MNL_________________ www.leapallergy.com [This message has been edited by Mike NoLomotil (edited 08-18-2001).]
 
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